David Nakhla 0:00

Welcome to the Reform Deacon, a casual conversation with topics specifically designed to help local Reform Deacons. There are nearly a thousand deacons in the OPC alone, so let's take this opportunity to learn from and encourage one another. We're so glad you could join us. Let's jump into our next episode.

SPEAKER_01 0:22

Hi, my name is Chris Dugan. I'm the communications coordinator for the Committee on Deactivist and Adapters. I'm usually on the other side of this recording acting as the producer for the Reform Deacon, but I recently had the opportunity to interview Seth Long, elder at Neon Reform OPC in Neon, Kentucky. Seth also serves on the Committee on Deactivistries. As many of you know, at the end of July 2022, NEON and 13 surrounding counties experienced what they call the thousand-year flood. I thought it would be good now, six plus months after the flood, to hear from Seth about how NEO is doing, what the landscape there is like, and how plans for a spring OPC disaster response effort are still needed. I hope you enjoy the episode while considering how you can help. Let's jump into the episode. Hey Seth, how are you?

SPEAKER_02 1:16

I'm better than I deserve.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

Same. Yeah. What I want to do is sort of have you paint a picture of what life in Neon is like now, six six plus months after the flood.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

I I think I'll I'll paint a picture uh from a community-wide perspective, not just neon, because neon's a small place. I'm pinned it up on the map. But so one of the things that that really uh impresses me and amazes me is that we can be more than six months out after the flood. And it's almost like it's it's four weeks after the flood right now. There's not, in some ways, there are not a lot of things that have changed. If you're to drive through Neon right now, uh you see some of the places coming back to the business, like the bank who has resources, they're they're back and open. Um, but the pharmacy is bare bones. I mean, it's just plywood on the front yet. They've got some things on the shelves and they're doing prescriptions. But other than that, the whole thing looks like a um scene from the hunger games almost like it's dark, it's still muddy, there's still dirt on the streets, there are storefronts boarded up and down the street, but that's just a neon proper. If if you go out and about, you see the litter, the debris, and then if you take the time to notice, you see empty houses that have been abandoned and or people in houses that I know that were flooded. You see all this, and it's um it's amazing to me that we can be in this shape even over six months out from the flood. The the flood was highly unusual. We've had a lot of VoAC groups come through here that do national disaster work, and many of them is have I heard have heard them say in conversations or speaking with them, this is the worst disaster that they've seen because it's so widespread. Um, and it's it's in an area of persistent poverty, too. That's the other thing that kind of ups the ante there a bit too. It's not like our our housing stock was in great condition before the flood. We we had a housing crisis before the flood, and it it had nothing to do with that. Our housing crisis has nothing to do with housing crisis of 2008 in North America. Before the flood here, we have a housing market, a broken housing market, not because of any one single issue, but because of many, many different issues. In order to point that out, in my day job as the executive director of Homes Incorporated, a nonprofit that deals with affordable housing issues. I often to get people who aren't from here to understand in our county, we are the only developer of housing here. And we are the developer of housing because we're a nonprofit and we can take those kind of risks and apply subsidies to projects to uh mitigate our risk in developing properties to sell uh to people. But a for-profit builder won't come in here and touch a piece of property and build housing. So that's just a kind of like our housing market is broken the whole way up from the bottom. Entry-level housing, all the way up, it's hard for anybody to find housing because there's not a whole lot much of it. And I could talk to you for about four hours about those subjects if we wanted to, because that's my day job. But um, I think in a nutshell, uh, I saw on a Facebook post uh this morning that somebody says um we we had a couple inches of rain last night, and there were a lot of people going out last night uh of their houses with flashlights and stuff and just checking it out because there's kind of like this PTSD effect that the flood has on people. Because that that last flood, it was so unique in that it was another it they call it a thousand-year flood, and it was a flash flood. It didn't it like rose within minutes, and that little stream that runs through Neon that you can practically jump across became probably about 300 yards wide and 12 feet deep in the middle of town.

SPEAKER_01 5:57

You could literally almost jump over it. Is that true?

SPEAKER_02 6:01

I'm a I'm an old fat guy. I could jump across the the creek, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:05

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 6:06

Never imagined that it was that it's just it's a stream. It's not a river, it's a stream, it's the headwaters. One of the things that's interesting about Letcher County is um it we're we're high in elevation, and it's Letcher County is the headwaters of the three different river systems that come out of there. And one of those streams that's a headwater runs through Neon and it's the North Fork of the Kentucky River. It's the Boom Fork that runs into the North Fork of the Kentucky River, which goes into the Ohio River eventually. And it it is literally just a stream, and it became a raging river, but but not just in Neon, this is in 13 counties, yeah, yeah. So it's not just like this section of the county got hit really hard by that rainstorm. This is in 13 counties that were declared, I think it's actually 14 now, uh, national disaster areas getting FEMA distinction uh designation. And um, there were four counties that were hardest hit, and one of them being Leccher, where Neon is located. So it was a completely unique atypical storm that has left this region reeling. Um, in my work in housing, I say that 25% of the houses where people were living, uh, families were displaced in 25% of the housing. You take an area where you have a housing crisis and a lot of substandard housing to begin with, and you take 25% of it out of the picture, um, that's a problem. And it continues to remain a problem today. And I would also say with that that some of those people um, you know, will definitely move back into housing, pick up flooded. Um, and the but many won't. Um many, many are not moving back. And and those are situations that we're dealing with. The other fascinating thing about this flood is, you know, some people have wanted to paint the picture of, you know, these these poor people, they build by the rivers, and you know, it's kind of what the they get what they deserve, you know, they should have known better. I've I've heard that narrative, but 80% of the houses that were flooded were not in the floodplain.

SPEAKER_03 8:24

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 8:25

80%. 80% of the houses that were flooded were not in a floodplain. This river raged up and beyond the floodplain or the church building in Neon. If you look at the flood maps, the back one little bit of a corner touches into the floodplain. I mean, it just touches into it, maybe, maybe four feet into it, um, on the one corner. And in the sanctuary, it was six and a half feet deep. Well, throughout the building, it was six and a half inch feet deep at that location there. And we're on the slope up out of town, too. You know, it's not down at the belly of the town there. So so it's all those things wrapped into a picture that is it can be very depressing. It can be depressing to live here. I think it wears on the people. You know, you you you drive to work every day and you see the debris up in the trees where that flood water was. Of course, it's winter time, it's damp, it's dark, it's cold, you know, and you just see all this litter and debris, and you just think, uh, it's a it's a daily reminder of the flood. We'll be looking forward to spring when things green up. You can't see so much of it. But you know what, it's still there.

SPEAKER_03 9:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

The other thing I was reflecting on the other day, my daughter uh writes poetry, and I was like, I I'm not a poet, I can't write poetry at all. But there's a poem somewhere in some of the images I see, and particularly on glass surfaces, you can see uh where the water levels were during the flood. Even on our church building, you can see on the outside on the glass surfaces that stain of mud and muck that that's still there. But you have to look for it. If you're driving by, you're not going to see that. You know, it's it's a dimming reflection of the destruction that happened behind. But the reality of it is objective and tangible in people's lives.

SPEAKER_03 10:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:25

I went out to uh visit an elderly man where a long-term recovery group um case manager contacted our organization, wondered if we could help this old man. He's in his 70s. He lives in an old camphouse, and I visited him in his home. The smell of mildew and mold will knock you down.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

And he's living in that.

SPEAKER_02 10:53

He was that day, that was just like a week and a half ago. He was living in the house. The floodwaters took out the underpinning and the foundation under his house, so it opened everything up. And he rats got into his home. And he has an infestation of rats that he can't get rid of. He it wasn't dirty, it wasn't nasty, but he could not get there in his couches, in a stove, in his walls, and just everything else. And and what amazed me was at this location, I could not imagine that the floodwaters had gotten that high. That house had never been flooded before. And it just I just stood there shaking my head and and just thinking, how in this world did the flood waters uh get this high? This this man is now uh living in a camper, uh, emergency camper provided by the state. Um, we are able to put together a housing plan to get him into a new home that hopefully we can build for him at a different location outside the floodplain. But the fact of the matter is, this is my job. I'm doing this every day, and I'm still shocked and amazed at the damage that this flood did. And then the people, this man was living in this house since the flood. And there are literally thousands of folks like him, still yet in houses that haven't been properly mitigated, dealt with, cleaned up. Um, I'm seeing where people quickly after the flood, they took it upon themselves to muck out and clean up, you know, Clorox, the floors and stuff like that, and thinking they've got it whooped. And like even just within this week here, driving around the community, seeing uh families that have a dump truck outside their house and are now going in and tearing out the walls and those two or three levels of flooring that are stacked together and building up mold. Um, if if the houses weren't properly cleaned, dried out, and mitigated for mold, that mold comes back with a vengeance. And this winter weather with heat on in the house is the perfect atmosphere for that to flourish and to grow. And I guess my point is these uh examples that I talk about are not one-off, but you know, they repeat themselves over and over and over again. Um I guess too um it's not all about doom and gloom either, you know, because as Christians, um, you know, we know that the Lord has uh brought this to us, don't always understand the whys of why things happen, but we know that the Bible teaches this is for our good and his glory. And I think with the um the church is is is the way that that really shines forward. As Christians in my day job, I can, you know, live out my Christian calling in my vocation and helping people, but still yet it's nothing like the church coming together uh with the declarative ministry of the hope of the gospel and and that type of thing, and and Christians coming together and helping people through the church, and that's where real ministry happens.

SPEAKER_03 14:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:04

I believe the the work at the work in my day job has taught me that over 30 some years.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Are other churches in the county and other counties that have been affected, are they back up and running and doing relief efforts?

SPEAKER_02 14:19

That's a big question. I hate to paint too too broad of a brushstroke. You know, I don't want to be a little bit careful with that. The churches in our community typically don't have the bandwidth or the resources to do a lot on their own to reach out to community, just like Neon, really. I mean, if it was up to Neon Reformed Presbyterian Church, we would not be doing much at all. But I think one of the things that really uh benefits us as Presbyterians and our form of government and our connectedness with churches is, you know, congregational churches are kind of, in a sense, to a certain degree, islands to themselves. There's a great blessing being part of a connected church where the church comes together to help a small, powerless church that's been impacted. And it's this isn't the Reformed Presbyterian doing all this, these good things that have been done so far. You know, even our own building, if it was up to us, we would still be in a world of hurt, honestly. But it's the broader church that has come in. So I I think a lot of these congregational churches don't have that backing or that help. So you don't see as much of that. But what you do see is is groups um connected to these churches. Like I know the Southern Baptists have the disaster relief uh arm, uh, and and they've done quite a bit of work in here, but I don't think it's necessarily connected with a particular local church either. You know, it's different, it looks a little bit, it looks more like parachurch in a lot of ways, okay, uh, is what I see. But they have they in a sense it is churches helping.

SPEAKER_01 16:00

So have you seen in NEON because of the flood, the communities sort of come together in a way that you hadn't seen before?

SPEAKER_02 16:11

I think there are ways in which the community has come together. And one of the one of the ways that I see it is in my vocation. All of a sudden, and I've tried to start this conversation before, but there was never any ears to listen. But now there's a conversation going back, uh going around about how do we move forward? Are are we actually going to build back where we got flooded before, or can we do something different? And doing something different was outside the grasp of any kind of reality in the past, or desire. It seems like most folks were uh satisfied with status quo. This is the best we can do, this is the way it is, this is life here in Appalachia. But like I said, last night it rained, and I think people living in places that got flooded didn't sleep well last night. So there's a conversation going on. People are coming together and it's talking about okay, how can we do better? What do we need to do? So, in those ways, I see people coming together, and I also see that like immediately after the flood, it it didn't matter who you were, if you had ability and resources, you are out helping your neighbor, even if you didn't get along well with your neighbor. That those differences kind of went away for a short period of time when there was immediate crisis and everybody was in trouble and people just pitched in to help regardless. So, so that that was a different feel to it.

SPEAKER_01 17:47

So, how would you say overall spiritually, the community is dealing with this? So, are they looking to churches because Neon Reform has been able to help in some ways? Have you seen sort of an uptick in attendance and curiosity and conversation?

SPEAKER_02 18:05

That's a that's a hard question to answer. You know, most of the help that we received so far, most of the focus of the work that we've done, it's really been somewhat inward, you know, like focus on the building and getting things restored. I mean, that was the bulk of the energy dollars and commotion. And I think one of one of my fears uh is that the people see that and say, well, they really are gonna care about themselves and they're really not going out, right? I don't know, I haven't heard that, but it's an optic that I'm I'm aware of that could be perceived by people. So when we started going out, um one was that last fall, probably um late summer, fall, uh, it it was a great thing, I think, to have um some representatives of the congregation, though they weren't from the thinking of Kenley and Jeff Davis and some of the other folks that came to work for a while. It was good for them to be going out into the community and being recognized by those who are helping, I think, because they were going out trying to find people that we could assist and help. Yeah, and then I also know that um there have been some conversations by by people that we've built sheds for hope uh at, and they've had conversations with me and with the pastor, and some have visited, others haven't, but I I think people take notice. But we're trying to, I think what one of the things that I really appreciate about uh the CDM and the oversight group is we're trying to help people well, and it's it's not just about the physical things that they've lost, and people have lost a lot, it's about their spiritual condition, their soul, and ultimately about the gospel. So um indeed. But that's I think one of the things that I really appreciate about the the help that has come through our church.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

And that's what the basis of disaster response is for us, is pointing back to the local church. Because once we, you know, the the volunteers from afar leave, you want to leave something behind to nurture what you've done, the progress that you've made physically in a spiritual way.

SPEAKER_02 20:23

Yeah, it's a lesson that I've learned working uh for homes. You know what home stands for?

SPEAKER_01 20:32

I think so, but remind me.

SPEAKER_02 20:33

It's it's housing-oriented ministries established for service. And what when I when I came here, uh I certainly wasn't reformed, but I came out of the Mennonite church. Um, and just just thinking about my thoughts throughout the years and coming to understand better uh the role of the church and how ministry really happens to the church, um, and how and the pitfalls of short-term missions uh that can happen and also para-church ministries and all that kind of thing. Um, I really this has firmed it up for me that ministry really happens in the context of the local churches. We have I've seen a lot of churches come through our organization to help people here, but they come and they go without a real place to anchor into the community.

SPEAKER_01 21:24

It's almost overwhelming, yeah. Um, what you deal with on a regular basis. And I don't know how you do it. The grace of God, I'm sure you would say being a mission work of the OPC, you don't have a deaconate that you can rely on for this. How difficult has that been?

SPEAKER_02 21:43

Yeah, I I think um I think not having a deacon in a mission church is a mistake. I think we've learned that the the office of a deacon is a spiritual office. And they have spiritual gifts, and elders don't necessarily have that. Pastors don't necessarily have those gifts and abilities to help people. So what happens is you have people that do the best they can to fulfill those jobs, but they don't do a good job at it. And I feel that firsthand as an elder in the mission work that some things have been placed upon my shoulder. And I was just like, how would a deacon think about this? What is the biblical response? But again, a lot of that wisdom and insight is a spiritual gifting that comes. And I think I think the Lord has equipped. I'm not saying that me and Pastor Day are totally inept or inadequate, but um it would be a lot different if we had a deaconate on the ground over the years. And I also think that it puts especially an undue burden on the minister, uh, the evangelist, um, as he's come to uh do the work of the ministry of the word, and then there's all these deed issues on his plate, too. So he gets sidetracked, overwhelmed, confused. Um it's distracting. And I think it can easily lead to burnout and ineffectiveness um when too much of that falls on him, because a lot of it does, because they're the full-time person. I would love to encourage uh uh homitians uh when they think about um doing mission work, not only to front load um resources with an evangelist, but also to think about uh the deed ministry as well, because word and deed go hand in hand.

SPEAKER_01 23:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

Those issues of the deaconate are going to be there. They are going to arise, and how are they going to be handled? I think there's many different ways that that could be handled uh in a mission work context.

SPEAKER_01 24:09

Yeah, yeah. Do you think that there's still a place for sheds?

SPEAKER_02 24:14

I I do think there's a place for sheds. I think for me, I think people could use them and and they come in handy. Yeah, I don't think it's the only thing that we're going to do. So I think it it works like well to prong. Like there's a need.

SPEAKER_01 24:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:29

It's a it's not high skilled, it's a handy couple day project, and it kind of comes together like that. But yeah, I think there'll be more other things that we can do too.

SPEAKER_01 24:39

And there's plenty of non-skilled work to do, raking, you know, cleaning out, would you say?

SPEAKER_02 24:46

Yes, yeah. There's there's plenty of non-skilled work. We need some skilled people too, uh, but there's plenty of non-skilled work to be done in in even even like you know, somebody's house that has debris laying around it, you know, Loma Creek Bank or something like that. That can that can be more for people to get things cleaned up than what people realize. Yeah, I think too.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

So yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much for taking the time. I know you're crazy busy. Praise the Lord. Thanks so much. Go to opcdisasterresponse.org to find out more or to register to volunteer for the spring effort, which starts March 1st. You can also reach out to our volunteer coordinator, Jane, by emailing Kentuckyvolunteers at opc.org. That's Kentuckyvolunteers at opc.org. Thanks for listening. And be sure to like, share, and comment. We really do like comments.

David Nakhla 25:38

Thanks for joining us. Go to our website, thereformdeacon.org. There you will find all our episodes, program notes, and other helpful resources. And please make plans to join us again next month for another episode of the Reform Deacon podcast.