Speaker 1: 0:00

Our mandate is perfect religion and undefiled before God, is to visit the orphan and the widow in their affliction and to remain unspotted from the philosophy of this world, and that is every Christian's work.

Speaker 2: 0:16

Welcome to the Reformed Deacon a casual conversation with topics specifically designed to help local Reformed Deacons topics specifically designed to help local Reformed Deacons. There are nearly a thousand Deacons in the OPC alone, so let's take this opportunity to learn from and encourage one another. We're so glad you could join us. Let's jump into our next episode. Hi, my name is David Nochlin. Today, on the Reformed Deacon, we'll be talking with two OPC Deacons whose day jobs comprise work that is actually very diagonal in nature.

Speaker 2: 0:47

David Pendergrass is the executive director of Sweetwater Research. Sweetwater Research is a non-profit that designs and supports holistic water strategies and education to improve the effectiveness of water projects around the world in a gospel-centered manner. David serves as a deacon at Covenant Reformed OPC in West Plains, missouri. So welcome to the podcast, david, thank you. And then we, secondly, are blessed to have Greg Harrison patching in from Romania. He's a deacon at Second Parish OPC in Scarborough, maine, serving there for almost 20 years before moving to Ukraine in 2018. And now, because of the war, they live in Romania. Greg, along with his wife Bonnie, have opened their home to Ukrainian orphans orphans with special needs special needs, those orphans who are now refugees, and they now run this nonprofit organization called Hearts of Hope Ukraine. Greg, thank you for joining us.

Speaker 1: 1:53

Thank you, david, good to be here.

Speaker 2: 1:55

Welcome, david and Greg. I'm excited to have both of you here to talk about your respective work or maybe more accurately, your callings, as they are very much works of mercies. I've interacted with both of you over a number of years and, david, this is the first time we've had the opportunity to, besides being on a conversation, kind of be a little bit face-to-face. And then, of course, greg, I've had the privilege of visiting you in Romania and seeing the work firsthand of Hearts of Hope. So maybe for about five minutes or something like this, introduce yourself and the work that you're doing and kind of how the Lord even led you into that work, and we can start with you, david.

Speaker 3: 2:36

Yeah, I think the best way to begin is to say that I'm a water scientist who loves Jesus, and what Sweetwater does is water for the body and water for the soul, and we do that through science, education and research. I got started on this path because way back in high school up in St Louis I did a water ecology class with the Missouri Botanical Gardens and we went around for a year to various streams in Missouri finding out how to look at water quality based on what lived in the water. That fascinated me. Here. God gave us so much, so many resources that we can use to take care of the world that he made. I've always been a bit of a nature boy. You know, loved to be out in the woods and trying to name the trees I saw, or turn over rocks and see what lived under them.

Speaker 3: 3:25

In 1998, I was at Covenant College and it was a Sunday afternoon. I was journaling after church out in front of Davis Hall and I said, lord, I've got to pick a major. I could do English, I could do music, I could do biology. What should I do? Please guide me. Holy Spirit, you're the one who made me, and I was meditating on Ephesians 2.10, that the Lord has saved us unto good works that he prepared in advance that we should walk in them. Well, if God prepared me in advance for some work, that means there's some skill in me, some natural disposition that I can lean into and invest in and trust that, when the time comes for me to apply that for the spread of the gospel, for the speaking of God's glory within my field of expertise, that he would open that door. So I committed myself to biology because I said you know what? I've always been a curious George. I love water. I want to become a water scientist.

Speaker 3: 4:29

Just a couple of months later, I met Mark McLaughlin with SIM in Ethiopia. He was an agroforester working there and he invited me to come over for a few months. So we did some ethnobotanical research and interviewing local farmers out in the rural villages of the highlands of Ethiopia, and that opened doors for the gospel with these men. I thought, oh, this is great. I am loving this. Here's a platform for me as a scientist to share the love of Christ. I decided to invest in my master's in aquatic biology.

Speaker 3: 4:58

I graduated in 2006 from Texas State University and from there took a job as a water scientist in Texas for 10 years with the Texas Institute for Applied Environmental Research, because I knew that if I was going to go over as a scientist to some place in some far-flung part of the world, I had to give real information. That was truly helpful. Why would people listen to anything I have to say about spiritual water if the physical water I have to say about spiritual water, if the physical water I'm telling them about is all broken and I'm not offering any real solutions? That was a great training ground for me. 2017, I decided to launch Sweetwater Research as kind of the full fruiting of all of that.

Speaker 3: 5:40

Training and investment of time, money, just leaning into the wisdom of mercy ministry, speaking with elders, deacons, pastors, reading books when helping hurts was a huge influence. What Sweetwater is is the formation of 30 years of gathered wisdom and education and investment. To draw from the parable of the talents, I'm not the guy with the 10 talents, I'm the guy with the two talents. There's not much I'm good at, but I can do water science and I love Jesus and I'm going to invest there.

Speaker 3: 6:15

Over the last eight years, then, the Lord has been blessing us little by little with growth. We've grown so much more than where we started with growth. We've grown so much more than where we started, but we're still a small nonprofit 501c3. But whether I was a scientist in academia, bringing the gospel to the atheistic materialists in the dark world of scientific academia, or whether I was ministering to the wit of the orphan and the poor in Ethiopia, I knew that I could always use water and my understanding of the natural world as a platform for the gospel. Everybody speaks the language of nature. That book is open to everyone, so I see my role as a translator to translate that language of creation into the language of special revelation in the scriptures. I can use that as a bridge and so I want to bring them into that language that God speaks to the Holy Spirit in his word.

Speaker 2: 7:10

Kind of like Jesus with the woman at the well.

Speaker 3: 7:13

Yeah Well, and with so many agricultural parables, yeah, yeah, absolutely so.

Speaker 2: 7:18

David, can you explain a little bit more about how Sweetwater Research works and your interaction with Ethiopia?

Speaker 3: 7:28

Yeah, we work with a process called CARE Communicate, ascertain, research and Educate. We start with communication. We don't invite ourselves into anywhere. People invite us in. We're a service for hire, a Christian service for hire, and so people communicate with us that they have an interest in bringing a water scientist into their situation because they recognize that water is at the root of so many of their diaconal needs. Where they're at. After we spend some time understanding what their felt needs are, I'll probe a little deeper to find out perhaps what some of the real needs are behind the scenes. I'll ask questions that prompt them to think about where their water comes from, what they're doing with it while they have it and where it goes when they're done with it, and how that impacts their local community. What are the interactions they have with their local church and what is the community's view of the local church? All of these go into kind of a hopper that I distill down into some kind of plan for how we're going to continue to interact in a project. Then we move from communicate to ascertain where we will actually go overseas to the location where we've been invited, maybe through a local leader, maybe through a church member, a parachurch ministry and we will ascertain what has God given them.

Speaker 3: 8:53

We don't begin with the question what do you lack. We begin with the question what do you have? That's what Jesus asked his disciples when he was feeding the crowds. He said what do you have? They brought the fish and the bread. He said that's enough, because you have me and I'm enough. We entrust to the Lord, in prayer, everything that he's given the people, whether it's the sweat of their brow, the trees that they've planted, the clouds in the sky, the sun in the sky to disinfect water. You can set out water in a clear bottle and the sun can, through its UV rays, disinfect the water very effectively really, and moringa is a wonderful water clarifier if you have turbid water. So we bring all this to the Lord and we say, lord, we offer this to you. Please work through us as scientists, as community members, to use what you've given for good purpose in bringing clean water to this community and, through that effort, open doors for the gospel.

Speaker 3: 9:53

So then we go from ascertain to research, where, if questions arise that need some scientific research to be done, or if we need to do some maybe sociological background information to understand what project would actually be sustained here? What are the local mores or government norms that we need to be aware of as we're developing the project? We do that research and we work up a work plan. We bring that to the people and we say here's the work plan, let's develop a memorandum of understanding with you. Whoever the point man will be, the person of peace, the local leader, the church elder perhaps?

Speaker 3: 10:36

And then we move to educate where, after we've done our research and we're presenting good information that's been vetted because, again, we don't want to give people trash. If we give them trash, they're not going to listen to what we have to say about Christ and we want real solutions to their water. Besides, we put into their hands what they need to be able to carry on the work. We don't give a man a fish. We teach him to fish and we apply that to the water sector.

Speaker 2: 11:03

Wow, that's really great, Well thought through, and my mind just is going with seeing how that can be very effective in lots of places. That's really, really great, thank you, david. So, greg, introduce yourself a little bit Arts of Hope, very different ministry and yet very diagonal and very meaningful in many ways. So maybe introduce yourself.

Speaker 1: 11:26

Sure, I've been a builder for a long time, mostly wooden buildings, but open to other materials and such, and that's kind of like my skill set that I bring to my ministry. But my wife and I, 10 years, almost 11 years ago now, adopted four kids from Ukraine. Before that, we were childless for 21 years as I was serving as a deacon, also experiencing the pain of childlessness, and so at age 47, my wife and I were like we got to stop talking about when we have our children, because that age has passed. You know, what are we going to do? All right, so well, most people adopt kids when they want kids. So we proceeded, we moved forward with that, we hosted our kids. We decided to go with Ukraine for many reasons because Russia shut down their adoption program the year before. We decided to adopt. So, long story short, we adopted four kids from Ukraine, from this little village in Ukraine, and five years later the Lord started putting on me in a real heavy way that there were some kids out there a whole bunch of them, actually that I met that over the process of adopting the four that I have, I met and I began to love these kids and I knew that they weren't going to make it because they're all kind of on the edge of functionality. Most of them were pretty well challenged with what they could do and I just I knew that these kids weren't going to make it. I started looking into what their lives were going to be like after they age out and it's a grim reality for these kids, like really extremely grim. And so I became like, the more I looked into it, the more I felt that we had to do something about it personally and we started hosting them.

Speaker 1: 13:40

Once in a while there's a hosting program. You can host an orphan from Ukraine and different parts of Eastern Europe, so we would host them and they would become my children. They're not adopted, but they're hosted. That broke my heart, to know that they weren't going to have a family. So my wife and I started praying about what to do, what to do, what to do, and we just talked and talked and what to do, and so finally a longtime friend of ours said well, you know, I think we can help you with that. We just came into a fairly sizable estate. We'll give you $100,000. You can start doing what you need to do. $100,000, you can start doing what you need to do so.

Speaker 1: 14:25

In 2018, we established an independent, like a not-for-profit entity and we named it Hearts of Hope Ukraine. Our pastor's on the board, we have people from our congregation that help us run it, and so we moved to Ukraine in 2018, bought a house, bought a van and immediately started taking in some of the kids we had hosted before that knew us and trusted us and they really wanted to live with us. So it wasn't long before we had four kids living with us full-time as young adults. But I'll tell you, nothing much in my life has ever prepared me for this work, and when God says I will not leave you as orphans, it wasn't a compliment Like, all right, so he calls us sheep, okay, which is another put down, because sheep are just crazy, smart and self-centered and clever. Sheep are not good animals and orphans are, I would say, the most dangerous people that you can get to know in many cases, especially the ones that grow up in Eastern European orphanages, because they learn from an early age how to be criminals, basically, and so you know, the four that we took in were the four that the traffickers didn't want. That we took in were the four that the traffickers didn't want, basically, and because one was an epileptic, you know she was going to die pretty soon anyways, they all have like really fairly profound disabilities. They were given to us and we started to learn to live together and you know it was really rough at first.

Speaker 1: 16:23

The first three years in an orphan's life in a family is like everything human depravity. And when Christ begins a work in you, he gradually brings you out of that depravity and into his kingdom by covering you with his blood, anyway. So in short, my work is discipleship of orphans. That's what I do is my wife and I work with specifically orphans and you know, not all of them are missing mother and father. So I say the poorest amongst us, because they are living in a wretched situation when they're in that orphanage or the group home where they're at. When they're in that orphanage or the group home where they're at, and it really takes three years for them to decompress, settle down and begin to process the gospel, begin to process information period. And so it's a commitment that my wife and I have made, a lifetime commitment. We're getting older I'm 58. My wife and I have made a lifetime commitment. We're getting older, I'm 58. My wife's 59.

Speaker 1: 17:46

Yeah, so our prayer, our aim is to not just provide a family for them, which they desperately need to do, but to bring them to Christ, to bring them into a relationship with the living God through Jesus Christ, to a relationship with the living God through Jesus Christ. And doing so brings a lot of glory to God because you know, people hear what we do and you know it's like just a natural open to the gospel. So in fact I've kind of come to the realization maybe Jesus says the poor you'll always have with you that he kind of maintains their lot. Some people don't want a lot of money, you know, and they don't go after it and sometimes they make sort of bad decisions. So they need a little bit of help. Or they have trauma and they can't make money. Or they have a little disability and they'll never make any money and they'll always need help. Disability, and they'll never make any money and they'll always need help.

Speaker 1: 18:49

And I think that our mandate is perfect religion and undefiled before God is to visit the orphan and the widow in their affliction and to remain unspotted from the philosophy of this world. And that is every Christian's work, one way or the other, with whatever gift they have, whether it be teaching, supporting, going, encouraging, visiting, whatever well for those are specially gifted to do the orphan? No, it's everybody. Perfect religion is practiced by all Christians.

Speaker 2: 19:32

You're challenging us to respond to what we're called to do.

Speaker 1: 19:35

Yeah, look who's the audience In James 1.27,. Who is the audience? It doesn't say who it is, it's obviously everybody audience. It doesn't say who it is, it's obviously all everybody. You know, every christian person out there, everybody that christ shed his blood for greg.

Speaker 3: 19:50

I think something that you're getting at is that the scriptures haven't said david pendergrass, I declare, will lead sweetwater research or greg will lead hearts of hope. What he has declared is that this is true religion will lead hearts of hope. What he has declared is that this is true religion I take care of the widow, the orphan, in their distress, and he's given us basic wisdom how to discern what are the gifts and talents that he's given us, and then we use them. It's easy to over complicate the matter, and others listening to us should not be intimidated by he's amazing giants of the faith. They're, they're doing water science and they're over helping the widows and the orphans in Romania and Ukraine and praise God for how he's manifested his will through us in ministry. But this is for everyone to consider, isn't it?

Speaker 1: 20:36

Yeah, in some way or another, like later in James it says you know I've given you gifts, now don't go spending it on yourself and your own lust. Build my kingdom. Do what it takes to get this thing James 127, done. Some people are great at serving a glass of water like one little glass of water, and that one glass can change a person's life forever. The Spirit can do all kinds of wonderful and weird things, and that one glass can change a person's life forever.

Speaker 2: 21:08

Spirit can do all kinds of wonderful and weird things. It's a part of it seeing the opportunities that the Lord places before us. Yeah, which is your story, greg, and your story, david. I mean, the Lord led you to the work that you're in. You know, in a sense you didn't go looking for that specific thing, but you did look to the Lord for how he would lead you in the area of service that you're in now.

Speaker 2: 21:41

Greg, if I could just add a little bit to your story, as I had the opportunity to visit you, what I learned is that your ministry is not just to orphans and orphans. The plight of the orphans in Ukraine is pretty, as you said, pretty bleak. I mean, these predominantly will turn into street children. They're in the orphanage for a period of time. Many of them will be trafficked and then many of them end up on the streets. And the ones you have actually taken particular interest in is actually many of them special needs orphans. So you say the plight gets even deeper when it's a special needs orphan. And now these special needs orphans are actually refugees since the war, are now refugees in Romania. They're Ukraine special needs orphans, ukrainian, who are now refugees in Romania.

Speaker 1: 22:26

Three of our girls were displaced twice. First time in 2014,. Dasha came to our town to another orphanage. They moved the orphanage over to Gilead, and Anastasia and Nastia. Both were moved from the war zone in 2014.

Speaker 2: 22:47

Yeah, eastern Ukraine just internally displaced from eastern Ukraine more to the west.

Speaker 1: 22:53

Yeah, you know this is the second time they've been displaced. And you know Dasha, who is now my son's wife, said to me that to be an orphan in your hometown is fairly difficult. It's a difficult life, but to be an orphan in a town where nobody knows you, nobody cares about you, nobody knows your family, nobody knows anything about you, is the most lonely thing.

Speaker 2: 23:23

Lonely and incredibly vulnerable, vulnerable to be taken advantage of because there's no protection measure.

Speaker 1: 23:29

Yeah, Nobody's looking after you.

Speaker 2: 23:32

And then if the other thing I was thinking I could just clarify a little bit more you visiting, but my sense is teachers to control the younger ones.

Speaker 1: 24:07

So they have free reign to do whatever they want to the youngers. So it's kind of like a university for criminals there, because they teach everything, all the tricks, all the lies. Yeah, they learn to be fairly dangerous, tricky people. They're treacherous and depraved and you know like at first, when you meet them, they're charming and they're cute and they are like little scammers. But that's all of us, that's everybody. God says I will not leave you as orphans. Okay, I'm not going to leave you in your depravity.

Speaker 2: 24:48

So, guys, people will hear these stories and be amazed. But it'd be easy to feel like you are the super deacons and the listeners will pray for you, but 99% will feel out of their league and not see any direct connection of this material to their lives. Possibly we want people to see that this is your calling, but everyone can think a bit outside the box. That's what we're calling this episode thinking outside the box about how to serve with a deacon's heart. So maybe you guys could talk a little bit about how your diaconal calling in the heart, or the hurting and needy that God has worked in you, that led to these opportunities.

Speaker 3: 25:34

I might address the word amazed in your question. I understand the human instinct to be amazed at somebody going overseas and being a water scientist. That sounds only for the important, intelligent people out there. I can tell you that that is not me. I'm not an amazing person, I'm just a dude. I'm just a guy who happens to like water and is analytical, and I love Jesus and I like talking about him.

Speaker 3: 26:04

How often did God speak to the prophets? Was it daily, or was it every 40 years or something? I mean, there was so much mundanity. There was so much day-to-day task work that was dull, boring. Everyone needs to remember that.

Speaker 3: 26:20

Our Father knows what we do in secret and what we pray in secret and when we in secret give money to someone in need, when in secret, quietly, we're discipling our children at home or the orphan on the street or a young man who's hooked on drugs in our neighborhood and he wants to do a bit of Bible study in our office.

Speaker 3: 26:42

Maybe the world isn't seeing that, but our Heavenly father is seeing it and he loves it. Take joy in God, taking joy in you doing what he's called you to do and built you for, and giving you the time and the opportunity to do. If you're a teacher in a classroom and you're speaking of Christ and his glory within your discipline that you're teaching. If you're a mother at home nursing a baby, singing hymns for that child to hear so they'll be able to sing them back to you in your old age, whether you're carrying trash for the local city and speaking of Christ to your co coworkers, whatever you're doing, take joy in the Lord, giving glory to him in that work. You don't have to be something you're not. If everybody was a hand, where would the foot be?

Speaker 1: 27:37

I'd say, you know, try to figure out what your gifts are and see how it fits in with loving people. Like, say, if you meet a homeless dude on the street, there's like 10,000 reasons why he's there, but just like, stop. I like to look them in the eyes, I like to ask them how they're doing, I like to touch their hand, you know, and if they ask for something, I always try to give it. You know, it's between him and god what he does with it. But I want to be that bridge that I'm asked to be for christ, like christ works through me, and to make connections with, with people.

Speaker 1: 28:22

So it doesn't have to be like this huge life commitment, you know, and it can be as simple as giving somebody a glass of water, like I said before. And Jesus said to be faithful in the small things and I'll give you bigger and better things to do. So I would say, focus in on those really small things that we're asked to do and that Jesus did daily in his ministry, like you know. Think of the Lord of the universe coming and washing a guy's feet. How many of us would do that?

Speaker 3: 29:01

Our local elders and deacons are also there. Lord has provided those for us. We can lean into them to understand us well. God has specially gifted these men for those tasks the elders as rulers and deacons as people with some insight into mercy ministry and how it can best be conducted, and possibly some wisdom into how God has in fact gifted you. Maybe just have the conversation with your elders and deacons, and your fellow laity for that matter. You know me well. Can you please talk through with me where you think my strengths lie, where my weaknesses lie as well, because that might also help form a vision for where you should be applying your gifts and skills in some practical outworking in mercy ministry.

Speaker 1: 29:48

Yeah, like most of us have a passion, like something that we were almost idolatrous about. Like we think about it, oh, wouldn't it be fun to do this. Well, that can be for the kingdom. It's usually an indicator of where your gifts lie, is what you think about doing all the time. And you know, like for me it was building and designing and for many years I didn't understand that I could use building and designing God's kingdom together in my mind that, yeah, I should be using this as in the work for the Lord.

Speaker 1: 30:24

It was kind of like for many years it was my business and I was trying to build my business and then I would devote a little bit of time on the side for the Lord and my diaconal work and such like that. But for me the focus was misplaced. My business was I thought of it as my business, not the Lord's business. And if we can like switch it around, there's actually a really nice book called Practicing the King's Economy. It's by a couple of Covenant grads how businesses can do their business with a focus on building the kingdom, and they used Letourneau as an example. He was pretty successful and he devoted 90% of his income to building things for the Lord, and he used 10% on his own.

Speaker 2: 31:24

He flipped the tithe on his head.

Speaker 1: 31:26

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 31:27

He lived he lived on 10% and gave away 90%.

Speaker 1: 31:29

Yeah, yeah, yep, and I, I think you know in America we we kind of really are focused in on, we think that our business is our own business, and then we a little bit of what's left over to the work of the church and the work of mercies.

Speaker 2: 31:47

But I do think that we could really prioritize in a more biblical way as business owners that even with ministries, which you're both in, the ministries and you as ministry workers, are able to do that through the sacrificial giving of others.

Speaker 2: 32:09

And so, whoever it was, greg, who gave that initial $100,000 gift, you know, sometimes that is the hand and foot, you know, one enabling the other, and that's, I think, that's, the beauty of the church, is that it's not this isn't my own personal ministry, but we work as a body. And yet, at the same time, I think we all should be attuned to the opportunities that the Lord brings us day in and day out Gospel opportunities, mercy, opportunities in our interactions, even if it's somebody sitting in front of a grocery store asking for a handout, interactions, even if it's somebody sitting in front of a grocery store asking for a handout, taking that opportunity to speak the love of Christ to them and show that in a tangible way. David, can you give a story from your work that, in a sense, would be a confirmation of the calling that the Lord has called you to at this time?

Speaker 3: 33:02

David, yes, if I'm doing my work right, people will be drinking cleaner physical water and will be hearing of the living water that Jesus Christ brings, the gospel. I was invited to Cambodia by a ministry that was working in the Siem Reap area in 2018. And we took a trip over there in 2019. They this ministry was delivering water filters ceramic water filters to villages, and these were supposed to take care of a family's water needs for several years, but they were only lasting several months because there was so much fine clay floating in the water that they were drawing from from these old pits that it was clogging up the little micropores in these ceramic filters, and I was tasked with finding some natural solution, working with what people had locally to bring about some solution there. So we prayed. The Lord said what do they have? We did a bit of research stateside while we could, and then we were brought over to Cambodia with this organization to see if it would work, and we quickly found out that it wouldn't. I also quickly found out that, although we were going to be in country for about a week, I really only had about three full afternoons at the location to in fact execute any of this research, so I was scrambling. First day was when we discovered that our original filtration idea was not going to work. It had to do with using some rice holes and some sand and things to kind of physically filter some of these clay particles out.

Speaker 3: 34:41

Second day was going back to the drawing board and saying, okay, lord, what do they have? And so we walked around the area and just observing what has God made in terms of trees, grass, dirt, sun, the people, what kind of strengths do they have? And we said, lord, open our eyes, what do they have? And I realized they have moringa. Moringa is a tree that grows like a weed in the tropics. It's very nutritious. It's also kind of a fatty food F-A-D-D-Y here in the United States, often as a nutritional supplementulant and flocculant, which means that it'll take small particles in the water, kind of bring them together almost like a snowball or little magnet shards to a piece of energized metal and it'll make that ball of clay reach sort of a critical mass to where it weighs enough that it will now sink more rapidly through the water and settle out at the bottom.

Speaker 3: 35:41

I knew this and this is part of the street water story because I had gone to the Educational Concerns for Hunger organization in Fort Myers, florida, to learn about tropical agricultural emissions, and I remember that there was some research there on moringa that it could do this kind of trick with the water. So I got online, I looked up a bunch of scientific papers and saw how they did their experiments, and then we created a sort of experiment just working with what we had, with a bit of Moringa seed that we crushed up, and we needed some water, some clean water, in order to test how making a Moringa solution would work on the dirty water. There was one particular kind of person I wanted to meet in this village that we were at. I said I want to meet a widow, because sweet water we minister to the widow, the orphan and the poor. Specifically, we aim at that. So does anybody here know a widow I could speak with who happens to have some water? We could bring her into the work. And they said, yeah, there's this woman named One W-U-N who lives down the road about 100 yards. Let's go see if we can use her. Well, she's happy to oblige, letting us take a bit of water from her. Well, that we could use in our experiments.

Speaker 3: 36:50

And then we noticed that there was a termite mound under her house and that that could cause some problems for her home. And so we asked her why are you leaving this termite mound up? It was about three feet high and very conspicuous. And she said well, the demons that killed my husband live in that termite mound and if I take out their home, they're going to kill me, and then my orphaned grandson, who I'm taking care of, will not have anybody to care for him. Through the interpreter, we said well, you know, you can be set free from the tyranny of the devil. Do you want to hear about Jesus Christ? Her voice shifted and she began to channel the demon and speak in a different language that she didn't know, and she began to tell us about how I'm the general of this and that dominion. And you have no authority here. You need to leave.

Speaker 3: 37:46

Rather than simply talking to the demon or trying to challenge the demon or do an exorcism, I said, through the interpreter, I'm going to tell you about Jesus Christ. And so we gave her the gospel Genesis through Revelation, focusing specifically on the power he has as king of kings to take out any enemy. She calmed down. She did not believe in Christ in that moment, but she did come back the next day in her right mind and she said I want to be a part of this project. How can I help? I found out after we came back from Cambodia that a few months later an evangelist a Cambodian evangelist went to that town again, gave her the gospel and she did believe. This is a town where there were almost no believers to begin. Now, the crazy cat lady you know the local demoniac is now one of the first believers in her village and is being discipled by that ministry that we came to help.

Speaker 3: 38:38

Moreover, we finally did get our solution when we, even though our first method didn't work it was trial and error. That's science. Something doesn't work. You go back to the drawing board, you try a new thing, you keep your notes. Through the scientific method, we were able to come up with a way to sort of maximize how Moringa was used to flocculate the nasty water, so that you could drink the water off the top of the bottle and let the sludge at the bottom be discarded.

Speaker 3: 39:08

We then came back with that information to the United States and I got an intern named Kaylee Holmark from Covenant College, who had just graduated in environmental science, and her project for a year with us was to maximize the Moringa method.

Speaker 3: 39:26

How do we use as little Moringa seed as possible with as little labor as possible to create the most clean water as possible in the shortest amount of time possible? That's now been developed into a manuscript that we'll be publishing Lord willing soon, in a scientific publication that will go out to the world. Now we have a light, not only in Cambodia but also to scientific academia and to the larger philanthropic world, so that more and more people can take what we've learned and apply it for the benefit of the widow, the orphan and the poor. Now we're bringing clean water physically and we're bringing the spiritual water of Christ, and when we go speak at scientific conventions about the research that we did, we always speak of Christ to all of these people who are in that room. So the Lord is opening doors for the gospel through the platform of water science.

Speaker 2: 40:12

Nice, nice, very good, greg, can you share a specific story through which we could see that your confirmation is where the Lord would have you be?

Speaker 1: 40:24

Yeah, I think I mentioned kind of how treacherous and beat up our kids are when they first come to us. I won't go on about that. And over a six-year period we could see that there was some fruit being born. There was some fruit being born that these seeds that God has worked in us to plant are starting to like soften the soil of their hearts, change their rocky hearts to real hearts, you know, functioning hearts. And so now they all profess Christ and they're just different people today. They have a relationship with Christ. They're calm, kind to each other, they do their daily work faithfully. They begin their day in their own private devotions and then they gather corporately before breakfast and they pray together for each other. And that's just to me more than I can really talk about.

Speaker 2: 41:26

Wonderful testimony.

Speaker 1: 41:27

And then the other sort of aspect is you know, we meet people and we do a lot of traveling because our church is an hour and a half, almost two hours away, so we take the train there when the traffic on the road is bad. So we meet people on the train and one night on the way back there were these Russian women on the train. These are people from Russia who are there at war with our country, and they heard our kids speaking Russian and so they kind of asked us where we're from and who we were and such. But when they found out about what we do for these kids, these orphan kids because people in Eastern Europe run from orphans because they have such a bad reputation they run from them and they say to each other why would you ever spend any time with this garbage? And they've said that to me, not these ladies. I'm with this garbage, and they've said that to me, not these ladies.

Speaker 1: 42:28

So when they found out what we did and why we do it because we're grateful to Christ for what he did for us and that we're pure garbage ourselves and Christ gave his life for us while we were yet his enemies, these ladies they're orthodox, and when they think they've met a saint. They want to touch you and they want to bow down before you, and I kind of felt like Paul in that moment, when he was basically worshipped and I, of course, I said no, no, we're not saints. We're no different than anybody, other than the fact that Christ died for our sins and we're grateful. That's it. It's simple as that, and we have the Spirit of the living God working in us to do this work. So, no, we're not anybody that you should bow down to or touch or anything, and it's available to you too. They were just like crying, and it was a to you too.

Speaker 1: 43:23

They were just like crying and it was a very sweet moment, so that's kind of like encouraging for us when that happens.

Speaker 2: 43:31

Yeah, Brothers, as you think about deacons who are listening to this and others, do you have practical ways that deacons can become aware or prepared and open to these kinds of ideas that fill our hearts with the deep sense of the gospel and God's work?

Speaker 3: 43:52

This may sound just a little too 30,000-foot view, but don't neglect your morning devotions. But don't neglect your morning devotions, don't neglect prayer. It's as we're looking into Christ's face that we become more like him. We become what we gaze into. Christ is so full of love and compassion and as we gaze into his holiness as well, we recognize our own depravity, our own sinfulness, and that we were the orphans that he came to. Greg is giving such a beautiful testimony of how we, as deacons, need to recognize humbly the state we were in when Christ saved us and that we are called as fellow sinners to those who are downtrodden under the tyranny of the devil, suffering under the weight of the pains of this life. Gaze into Christ and also.

Speaker 3: 44:50

He's given us his word for a reason. Use it for practical things. If he told us to care for the widow and the orphan, he's not going to simply give us that command and give us no other instruction. Psalm 119,. Open my eyes that I may see wonderful things in your word. Pray specifically, lord. What are my particular gifts and how can I use them to care for the widow, the orphan and the poor effectively, fruitfully, with perception of how you, holy Spirit, are working in my local community in the context of this little ministry moment. Why wouldn't he answer that prayer? Why wouldn't he give you the wisdom and the insight understand the providential circumstances that are going on?

Speaker 1: 45:35

I couldn't have said it better myself. That's exactly the answer that I had. So that's exactly the answer that I had. So you know, like I was going to say, zoom in on James 127, because it really is written to all of us. Zoom in on that and ask God to arrange a circumstance to obey that.

Speaker 1: 45:58

That is how he's glorified when people you know, like in Isaiah I think it's 58, what's the acceptable fast? You know what is the acceptable fast that we're called to do? It's to care for the widow and the poor and the orphan. And when you do that, then your righteousness will shine like the noonday sun and others will see that and glorify God and turn to him. That's his calling card when he sees people putting their skin in it and really devoting their life to it, it just blows them away, some of them, and it's like living proof that there is a God, because there's no human way to live with an orphan. There's no way to do it other than through the power of the living spirit, the living God, working in you and giving you wisdom and strength to go on doing that day after day. And to me, I think for some people it's like yeah, yeah, I see it now. See, there's a God as a savior and it just grabs their attention and that's kind of his mechanism, god's mechanism.

Speaker 3: 47:24

Greg and I both have had to do our homework at times in order to be more effective at equipping others to glorify God and enjoy him forever, by unburdening them of the sort of material needs, the circumstances that are weighing them down, that are depressing their full expression of the fruitfulness that they would have otherwise in Christ. For me, I had to go get my master's degree, at minimum, because I just simply couldn't operate in the world I wanted to operate. That piece of paper that says I went through the gauntlet of academia is my passport into other places where I can carry the gospel. Is my passport into other places where I can carry the gospel. I'm sure Greg has had to go through the ringer with local governments and understand the bureaucratic aspects of running an orphanage. There's a lot of paperwork that's associated with being a 501c3 or whatever the nonprofit equivalent is in his country.

Speaker 3: 48:18

So if you are a deacon looking for some practical thing here, as you're pressing into what you're good at, also ask the Lord is there some way I can improve on this gift? How do I invest in that talent? Going back to the parable of the talents, do I need to go get a degree to be able to press deeper into this field. Do I need to become more educated in some local bureaucratic paperwork so that I can kind of learn how to work the system to greater advantage on behalf of the people that I'm serving and then take action on it? Don't procrastinate. Why wait If the Lord has said love, mercy, do justice, walk humbly with your God. Don't overcomplicate it, just start doing it. Look for little openings the Lord has given you in the resources that he's put in front of you. You don't have to work with what you don't have. Work with what you do have.

Speaker 1: 49:06

God has not put us in charge of getting results from people in their lives. Getting the result is God's work, and so don't get discouraged if people don't cooperate with you. Just keep doing the work and God will take care of glorifying himself through you Faithfulness.

Speaker 3: 49:27

Are you guys familiar with Lillian Trasher?

Speaker 2: 49:29

I don't think so.

Speaker 3: 49:31

She had the nickname Mother of the Nile and in the early 1900s she opened an orphanage in Egypt. At the end of her life, having helped many, many thousands of orphans, an interviewer asked her what's the secret behind your success? I think it was even Time magazine, in fact, who was interviewing her, and she said secret to my success. There's no secret. The Lord told me to do something and I just didn't stop doing it. I love that emphasis, greg, on the tenacity of it. Yeah, if all the circumstances that the Lord's presented to you are to keep on in this thing, then keep doing it.

Speaker 3: 50:12

It can be very hard. I'm not saying it's easy. It certainly isn't. There are certainly days I've wanted to quit. But miracle, you know the ordinary means of grace, one of which is the fellowship of the saints. Right that other believers are coming around. Whether it's financial help, whether it's prayer, whether it's a word of encouragement, a good sermon. It comes in many forms, but the Lord takes care of his own and when he provides that encouragement, take it up. Don't push it away and say well, I'm just, I'm too depressed, too sad, I'm just, I can't even absorb it right now. No, drink up that water from heaven, put your roots deep into that stream. It makes glad the people of the city of God.

Speaker 1: 50:59

I'd say visit. You know, come and see the people in the field. Come and see us, because you can listen to a podcast and then forget about it 15 minutes later. Come and see what we do, meet our kids, see where we live, talk to us. If you can't come, then you talk to us on the phone. We're a little isolated Sometimes we feel like we could use a good conversation because we don't speak Romanian very much. It's nice to also be encouraged by people. They come and they pray for us. We've had some visitors this year and we've been really blessed, including you, david. We're very encouraged by your visit and if there's anybody out there that's interested in my work, in our work in God's work, come and experience it for yourself. Just visit, be the tourist. I'd love to show you around, introduce you to my family, and you never know what sort of little thing might come of that.

Speaker 2: 52:01

Greg, that's a great segue because one of my hats is short-term missions coordinator, as you know, and I know, david, that you took some trips that were. If I remember reading your history, there were some early on trips that were meaningful to you and I guess that's where Greg has certainly plugged it. Do you have anything to add to that with regards to just the impact of a missions trip type of opportunity to explore and how the Lord maybe even used that in your life to cement what he was doing?

Speaker 3: 52:30

I would give a very hearty amen to that. I'm still in communication with Mark McLaughlin. He's been a mentor for me these 25 years, since we were working together in Ethiopia in 99. Through conversations with him and doing some work between then and now in Ethiopia and doing some work between then and now in Ethiopia, he's been a critical factor in the development of Sweetwater and in my own missiology. And he and his wife are kind of lifers in the foreign mission field. You know they spent many decades in Ethiopia and are still involved there. Yes, and I can tell you and I think I'm speaking for Greg too, just based on the little I've gotten to know him in this discussion that it really is a joy and a privilege to mentor and to pass on what we have learned in our experience, not because we're the greatest experts in the world in what we do, but praise God that in our position, we have something to offer and we'd love to pour that into the next generation.

Speaker 3: 53:29

As a water scientist working through sweet water, one of our goals is to raise up that next generation of water scientists who love christ, and so there's a young lady named keba bush mulat in ethiopia right now, who's from the highlands, the very area where I work, and, uh, she recently received her master's in aquatic biology and she loves christ, and so we are working with her, mentoring her in her continuing progression as a professional to become a watered leader in her own hometown.

Speaker 3: 53:56

I mentioned the Cambodia project where we brought research back with us on Moringa, and there was an intern named Kaylee Hallmark. Well, she now has received her master's in environmental science from Penn State and is going into mission work as a scientist overseas, and she is a now board member with Sweetwater. She's completing a two-year term with us as a board member, and so we've been pouring into these people who have been working with us hands-on, actually doing the work with us in the countries where we're working. It brings great encouragement. Honestly, it keeps us motivated for the work when people want to get their hands dirty or, in my case, wet with the work.

Speaker 2: 54:34

David, do you ever have people travel with you when you do these site visits and investigations, or is that?

Speaker 3: 54:42

complicated, depends on where I'm going, but yes, in 2019, when I went to Cambodia, I took my then 11-year-old son with me and that was very impactful for him, really developed his sense of mercy, ministry, of the Lord's compassion for others who are not like him. This summer, in July, I went to northern Uganda with a man named Rob Dandridge, who's been just a terrific volunteer for Sweetwater, a very dear brother in Christ, and it really, I think, solidified his commitment to Sweetwater and gives him a stronger voice on behalf of our work. He's able to speak more confidently about what we're doing with others and help to grow the ministry and expand our ability to help others, Because the larger we get, the more influence we can have.

Speaker 2: 55:34

Do either of you think that being a deacon in a connected church very much? We talk about the network of deacons and connecting deacons local, regional, national, kind of in our Presbyterian form of government.

Speaker 1: 55:52

Has that helped in your work at all? Yeah, before we left, a couple years before we left, after we had adopted our kids, I saw a couple people in my church sort of take notice and start to be interested in fostering, and so we set up a fund for adoption and anybody that wanted to give to that line item in our budget could do that. And I just think that if we can sort of raise awareness of you know, we can really come alongside people. That I mean adoption each one of our kids cost us $40,000 and we didn't have any of it. It all got fundraised and so our church helped us.

Speaker 1: 56:35

Lots of different people chipped in, and so adoption is very expensive. So if a church has an adoption fund already set up, accessible to people that are interested in adopting, and then the other thing you can do is people that have adopted and that are fostering are going through things that nobody will ever understand unless you've done it, and so if you can just lend an ear to them, pray for them, don't judge them, don't judge their kids, and just really try to be there for them and love on them and support them, don't judge them, don't judge their kids, and just really try to be there for them and love on them and support them in whatever way you can. That'll maybe start the ball rolling and the James 127 thing.

Speaker 2: 57:23

That's good, and Greg also. It's my understanding that a lot of churches in the Presbyterian New York and England actually have come along as supporters of Arts of Hope, right? Yes?

Speaker 1: 57:34

Yes, indeed, I don't know if I can mention. I mean, you've given us, over a two-year period, $30,000 over one year and $30,000 just recently.

Speaker 2: 57:45

Yeah, our involvement has been mainly because of the refugee situation, and so that has enabled us to come alongside what you guys are doing, insofar as it's a ministry to Ukrainian refugees. I mean, that's been the context of it.

Speaker 1: 58:04

And our local church, Second Parish. We're on their budget. We're on the budgets of two or three other Presbyterian LPC churches in Maine and individuals also give to us. But, yeah, the church has been very supportive increasingly, so that's good, yeah. So we're very thankful for that and praise God for the work that he's done in the hearts of people that are making those decisions.

Speaker 3: 58:33

I think for me the connection to the OPC in the last four years has been transformative for me, understanding both my role personally as a deacon, what that means to be an officer, what it means to be specifically a deacon in the church of God. It's also been transformative for me to understand the best way to express that ministry professionally, in the form of Sweetwater. What is our goal? Is it simply to operate all the time as a parachurch ministry, just kind of casually working with Christians regardless of what church they're in? Or is it to solidify, to undergird, the relationship that a local church has with its community? For example, in Jeremiah 29, 7, as the exiles are about to go into Babylon, god says when you get to this place, work for their good, for in their welfare will be your welfare. Place, work for their good for in their welfare will be your welfare. We're all in this nest together. Everybody drinks water. Some of those who drink water are going to heaven, some who drink water are going to hell, but we all drink water, as Christians and non-Christians are in that same ditch together, digging for that well water. Conversations about Christ will naturally occur If we can work through the local body of Christ, wherever that's at to be, the place where people go to find out something about clean water. Then also there's opportunity to become connected to the body of Christ, because it is through the church that salvation is normally accomplished by Christ. It's through that preaching of the word, it's through that shepherding from the elders, through the service of the deacons, through the fellowship with the laity, through the sacraments, through prayer. This is all provided through the church principally. So Sweetwater, though a parachurch ministry that is not connected to a particular denomination, does have a statement of faith and those of the Reformed faith will pick up on the Reformed cues, you might say in the statement of faith that I've presented on our website.

Speaker 3: 1:00:50

We intend to be a broader range of mercy challenges, because in some places where cholera, dysentery, typhoid are a major problem, that's a suffocating burden. It covers everything, it overshadows so many things. We send medical missionaries overseas all the time, but they're mostly treating at the symptom side. Sweetwater's able to deal with the cause side. We want to deal with the causes of the water pollution that are leading to all of these health difficulties where so much of our money and time is being given.

Speaker 3: 1:01:23

Imagine how much time if you're a deacon in a church that's burdened by water stress. How much time would you have for ministering in other capacities if you didn't have to minister to 50% of your congregation that was at home sick with dysentery? Parched throats don't praise God, nor do parched souls, and hungry stomachs have no ears. We've got to free people up to be able to attend the Lord's Day worship. We've got to free people up from be able to attend the Lord's Day worship. We've got to free people up from all these medical problems where so much of our time and resources as the body of Christ are being put. So there's definitely an ecclesiastical focus, ecclesiastical effort. Let's say. Even though Sweetwater is not a church, nor is it affiliated with a particular denomination, I, as a deacon, certainly have my ecclesiastical motives.

Speaker 2: 1:02:13

Let's say that's good, thank you.

Speaker 1: 1:02:17

One thing that my local church did for me was to preach a good, solid theology to me for 21 years. A good, solid theology to me for 21 years, and that gave me the foundation to go out and do whatever it was I needed to do and the motivation to do it. Amen, amen and amen. And I would say, you know, to the churches keep preaching the full word of God and don't skimp on the sovereignty of God in all things, because he can do amazing things through worms like me and things like that, and he equips his saints with the word to go out and do the work he needs to have done or he chooses to have done through us. So keep preaching the word, you pastors of you churches.

Speaker 3: 1:03:11

Something I want to tap back into. Greg, you were talking about how long it takes to work with these orphans. This is not a one-touch thing. You don't just interact one time with orphans, you're interacting over a lifetime with the orphans. We have to remember as deacons that our purpose is to bring people into that fullness and fruitfulness of their relationship with Christ. It is not simply to fix some immediate need. Yeah, it's holistic. It's holistic Just going back to sort of the founding of the diaconate in Acts 6, in its prototype form there that one of the purposes, in addition to taking care of the physical needs of the widows, was to free up the spiritual work of the apostles.

Speaker 3: 1:03:59

It is definitely a holistic effort. And so, as deacons are working through their particular skill set, wherever they're at their unique calling and gifting, ask that question how can I apply this for connecting the people I'm working with into a local body, preferably their own, preferably a solid, reformed church, but regardless that they're in some kind of care of a local shepherd, because that under shepherd is there to bring food and water for the people, to give that word of God, and we're trying to not be the one in charge of that person's spiritual growth.

Speaker 2: 1:04:39

We're trying to connect them up to Christ, who is Exactly, yes, yeah, that's the importance of the local church, and really plugging people ultimately into the local churches has got to be at the basis of what we're doing.

Speaker 1: 1:04:48

Yep, you know this kind of leads into. Your next question is what our situation is. The churches are all based in urban areas. We're not an urban ministry, you know. We want to be where the poor people are, and that's in the mountains. It's in kind of fairly inaccessible places, and so part of what we envision and hope and pray that God will do is that we'll also become church planners, because we need people that are apt to teach, to come alongside us to help us teach our kids. I'm not a very good teacher and so I do my best, but I know that there are people gifted in that we're praying that there will be people that come alongside us and teach our kids, help teach our kids and, at the same time, plant a church in the woods somewhere, and part of it is.

Speaker 1: 1:05:44

We're here in Romania. We're looking for a place to buy, and there's no place that's affordable to us other than something that's an hour away from the city, and that's a challenge that I know God is quite well aware of, and we're praying that he'll provide a place for us in a place where people need us. But we also need to be sustained spiritually, we need to be fed, and we can't just be like an entity unto ourselves out in the woods with kids. We just can't do that. We need to be a part of the body of Christ, and so that's one thing that we're looking for a solution to. We're praying about where to settle in Romania, if we're to settle anywhere, but right now we are commuting to church two hours one way, two hours back, and it's difficult. It's not sustainable really.

Speaker 3: 1:06:39

Do you hear that church? Do you hear that young man? Listen to what Greg is saying and step up.

Speaker 1: 1:06:43

Thank you. Yeah, we're praying, you know. Ask the Lord. We need younger people too, because we're getting up there in age and we would like the next generation to kind of come and come alongside us and get to know what we do and let's grow this. You know, there's 30 kids that call us mama and papa. I'm not under any illusion that I'm going to be able to help them all, but I'd like to help the ones that want to be helped, and there are a few there already, but we don't have a place for them yet. You know, we're hoping to settle somewhere and to start building our program and developing it, and there has been a bit of a two-year delay because of this war.

Speaker 2: 1:07:27

Thank, you, David? What are some ways that we can be praying for you and your labors?

Speaker 3: 1:07:33

There are two primary areas where Sweetwater needs help. We recently entered a phase of capacity development. We need $12,000 in recurring monthly donations. We're currently at four in recurring monthly donations. We're currently at four.

Speaker 3: 1:07:52

Because there's been a lag in donations recently, I've had to pull back on my hours. I simply can't give to Sweetwater what I used to and still provide for my family. So right now I'm seeking full-time work. If anybody out there has a ministry position that I can work remotely, I would love to do it. I'm good at water science and good at teaching. I love talking about the gospel, so if anybody out there knows anything that could be a work for me in that world, I'd love it.

Speaker 3: 1:08:16

The other thing Sweetwater needs is to develop our board. We recently added another board member, but we're looking for three more at least three more. These are people who love ministry to the widowed, the orphaned and the poor. They have a resume of working at the executive level and have gifts and talents that I don't have and that can compliment the gifts and talents of our existing board. So if you're interested in speaking with me about that, you can contact me by phone or email, which I think will be in the show notes, perhaps Show notes, yep, and you can also check out our website sweetwaterresearchorg. We're also on Facebook and Instagram.

Speaker 1: 1:08:56

Great. So we're funded, we pay our rent, you know, faithfully, and we're able to pay our rent in our own salaries. But we're not able to go beyond that right now. We actually don't have any money to buy a place and, no, we just don't period.

Speaker 1: 1:09:13

So I want to do the George Mueller thing, where he prayed and the money came and I am zealous for the glory of God in the way he provides and I recognize that. You know if, say, if I do ask for money and somebody answers that it is God 100% working in him to do that. Yes, but yeah, we could really use some capital to buy a place so that we can move on and accept the next crop of kids that are aging out, like right now. This year there's like five of them and they all want to be with us. We can build little houses for them. We have people lined up that want to be a part of our program, like, say, on a two to three month level, a time commitment, that have like skills that they want to pass on to our kids, but we we don't have a place to do that in yet. So the the program is a little bit on hold right now.

Speaker 3: 1:10:18

So when the church takes care of her own, it results in many thanksgivings to god. Yes, from second corinthians nine, and praise the lord for that. So whether you're the one giving the money, whether you're the one receiving the money, it's the Lord's and he's getting glory and praise him for it.

Speaker 1: 1:10:33

Yes, amen.

Speaker 2: 1:10:35

Brothers, I'm so thankful to hear your stories. Get a window into your hearts and what motivates you to do what you do, and we'll see how the Lord even uses this, not only in the hearts of deacons who hear and grow through the challenges and encouragements that you've given. But I'd say to the deacons out there, these are two deacons who are faithfully serving. These are essentially both parachurch ministries. They're not necessarily directly under the OPC, but these are faithful brothers and those who'd like to contribute towards their ministry, responding to the needs that they have to come alongside them. Information will be in the show notes for that. David, thank you very much for joining us on the podcast.

Speaker 3: 1:11:21

Thank you. The Reformed Deacon has been a great blessing to me in my young years. As a deacon only having served two so far I have much to learn, and the Reformed Deacon's been a big part of that.

Speaker 2: 1:11:31

Wonderful and, greg, thank you for joining us. Our listeners will not be so aware of the in and out that we've suffered by our Wi-Fi because our producer, trish, will do such a fantastic job in cleaning all this up. Thanks to Trish. But thank you, greg, for taking the time to join us as well. Sharing from your heart, yeah thanks very much.

Speaker 1: 1:11:52

We're very grateful, thank you.

Speaker 2: 1:11:54

And deacons, we hope that this episode will encourage you in your service to your congregation and possibly start thinking outside the box regarding the ministry of mercy in our parts of the world, in our corner of the vineyard. Through Christ Jesus, thanks for joining us. Go to our website, thereformedeaconorg. There you will find all our episodes, program notes and other helpful resources, and please make plans to join us again next month for another episode of the Reformed Deacon Podcast. ¶¶.